Isn't this a pretty substantial point of evidence that abortion and murder are not morally equivalent? :heavy sigh: Yes and no. Yes, it's a substantial piece of evidence if you accept that the bible is the inspired etcetera- it's a quote from the bible saying "Oh btw fetus does not equal adult". But using it in a serious debate, is like, lowering the debate to a completely crap level. It's accepting that we have to base our modern-day ethics on the opinions of bronze-age shepherds, that we have to take their opinions seriously.
And we don't weight Greek philosophers like that. Nor renaissance, or the Germans, or modern scholars like that. Nobody (except philosophy majors) seriously goes poring through the works of Hegel comparing obscure or contradictory lines, in order to try and prove this or that point in real life. It's baloney, everyone knows this intuitively.
Yet for some reason we accept arguing on the biblical terms. We're used to it. It gets thrown at us so often that we fight just like that, and then our debate, to any rational outsider, looks retarded (and is unconvincing).
So to me, there are two debates to be had, here. One is over abortion, and the other is over whether I should give a damn about what the bible says. And really, when I quote the bible to show that their views are wrong, that alone is not sufficient to shake their views- it's just enough to shake, at least until they get back to church on Sunday, the view that the bible has any damn place here.
So to me, it's not a substantial point of evidence either way regarding abortion itself, rather, it's a substantial point of evidence that the other person should shut it about the bible since it doesn't even support them, and start arguing on actual real life facts. Which is precisely how I would word it in debate.
And then we could have an argument about abortion.
no subject
:heavy sigh:
Yes and no. Yes, it's a substantial piece of evidence if you accept that the bible is the inspired etcetera- it's a quote from the bible saying "Oh btw fetus does not equal adult".
But using it in a serious debate, is like, lowering the debate to a completely crap level. It's accepting that we have to base our modern-day ethics on the opinions of bronze-age shepherds, that we have to take their opinions seriously.
And we don't weight Greek philosophers like that. Nor renaissance, or the Germans, or modern scholars like that. Nobody (except philosophy majors) seriously goes poring through the works of Hegel comparing obscure or contradictory lines, in order to try and prove this or that point in real life. It's baloney, everyone knows this intuitively.
Yet for some reason we accept arguing on the biblical terms. We're used to it. It gets thrown at us so often that we fight just like that, and then our debate, to any rational outsider, looks retarded (and is unconvincing).
So to me, there are two debates to be had, here. One is over abortion, and the other is over whether I should give a damn about what the bible says. And really, when I quote the bible to show that their views are wrong, that alone is not sufficient to shake their views- it's just enough to shake, at least until they get back to church on Sunday, the view that the bible has any damn place here.
So to me, it's not a substantial point of evidence either way regarding abortion itself, rather, it's a substantial point of evidence that the other person should shut it about the bible since it doesn't even support them, and start arguing on actual real life facts. Which is precisely how I would word it in debate.
And then we could have an argument about abortion.